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Just curious....

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Re: Just curious....

Post by Suggiemom on Mon May 12, 2008 10:48 am

:cheers: There's our girl....Avoidance is key, eh Lauren?

So, you lost someone very close to you and you don't have time to post in answer to yet another huge lack of judgement, betrayal, etc. on your part, but you can post pictures with your gliders playing on a toy? Cuz, there is always time in the day for the important things in life huh?

I really just don't see the point in responding to this thread it is what it is and I can't afford going insane trying to keep up on wtf I'm suppost to have lied about this time.

A)Maybe if you tried telling the truth once in awhile, keeping up with what lies you told wouldn't be such an issue for you Lauren and B)The point in responding is to help people understand that you know what you did was WRONG. Instead, you cop a Lauren attitude, say to hell with it and off you go with your tail tucked between your legs AGAIN. You have never once apologized for any of the things you've done. Oh no, instead you get pissy and point fingers at everyone else. Grow the hell up Lauren and take responsibility for your mistakes. Compounding them by running and avoiding just makes you look all the more guilty.

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Re: Just curious....

Post by Suggiemom on Mon May 12, 2008 10:50 am

While we all know Lauren's done some shady stuff before I have to say she's not the only one involved in this that's done questionable things before.

You wanna elaborate?

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Re: Just curious....

Post by Suggiemom on Mon May 12, 2008 4:42 pm

KitKatt, who are you talking about? Several people have posted, therefor are "involved" in this situation and it'd be nice to know who you are referring to. It almost sounds like you're excusing Lauren because someone else who has posted has done something previously and if that's the case you need to elaborate or do you mean "involved" as in Linda?

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Re: Just curious....

Post by kitkatt1216 on Mon May 12, 2008 5:06 pm

Laurie, not referring to you or anyone else who merely posted. And I think Lauren's made it clear she's somehow in the wrong, it's just exactly to what extent that seems to be the issue.

I was referring to something unrelated to this that the other person that was brought into question did in the past, in which I was personally involved, that makes me feel like there is the potential that she has more blame that she is willing to admit to. Dishonesty about one thing always leaves you questioning when that person is brought up in the future.
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Re: Just curious....

Post by SugarBaby on Mon May 12, 2008 5:53 pm

I'm not caught up on reading this whole thing, but I do have to get myself to work soon.

I stated the truth so I don't know what else you guys want from me. I am not running from this situation, I just don't know what else you would like me to say... no matter what is said, some of you will not believe it anyways. You seem to think there was some big scheme to decieve Priscilla and get her gliders for me, that was not the case.. "Tipette" had a deposit on her by Lauren before I even knew that she had become available again! One of the girls that Lauren got from Priscilla is in the condition of a bad rescue, she wanted to send her to me and went back and forth on trying to decide.. but she is not a bad glider mom and can handle simple situations such as an obese girl with crappy fur... I have encouraged her that she is just as capable as I am in that case. *I am going to see if I have the photos of her*

If you think I am shady and some horrible person, that's fine. But that is not an accurate representation of me. I am offered gliders on an almost weekly basis, some I am tempted to get, but 98% of them I do not get... Most of my gliders are rescues or gliders that were being passed from home to home, I'd rather any of them over purchased joeys because they are in NEED. I am drawn to needy people and animals, because I love to help. That's how I am. And as far as questioning my morals and just what I am doing with the gliders that I have, I welcome any of you to come and spend a week with me this summer... you can see the imperfect gliders that I have and the flat and empty poms on my boys.

I wanted to breed for WF/WT, I have talked to MANY people about it, I DO have my own WTs, and access to people that will sell me WTs if I wanted them, but I don't lie to ANYBODY to get what I want. It took me a long time to decide on what I wanted to do with Rudy, he was never paired up, still isn't, and won't be as an intact male. Hopefully I can find a WF/WT male to have neutered and join my pet families.
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Re: Just curious....

Post by SugarBaby on Mon May 12, 2008 6:11 pm

This is Robin.. the non-breeder that Lauren got with Tipette because she saw that the glider needed help weight wise, but had no idea about what she TRULY looked like! I'm not saying that this reflects on Priscilla.. but it's just shocking to recieve something in the condition that you will see below.

The photo from P's website:


And photos Lauren took:


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Re: Just curious....

Post by usha77 on Mon May 12, 2008 7:22 pm

Oh my goodness! The poor little sweetheart! I just want to take care of her! It can't be just the weight that is wrong with her, is it? :(
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Re: Just curious....

Post by Suggiemom on Mon May 12, 2008 7:49 pm

I don't think anyone thinks you're a horrible person Linda. I don't, but I have to say I'm curious now as to what KitKatt is talking about since she stated that she was personally involved in a situation where she's now questioning the events that happened apparently.

OMG, that poor glider! I wonder if this is a PP thing? The over weight gliders? I have five boys that originally came from her and they are HUGE, they've been on a "diet" for a year now and are just now down to a somewhat normal state even though they are still bigger than all of my other gliders. I changed them from Priscillas diet to a version of BML with my gliders and they're slowly losing a bit of the weight.

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Re: Just curious....

Post by queenduck on Mon May 12, 2008 7:52 pm

Linda, I think the point here is what Lauren said, about her own thoughts and actions.

[quote]The idea for getting these gliders and possibly sending them to Linda was my wish. I knew how badly she wanted them both maybe even more then us. I had paid for them and offered to send them without payment. [code]

What really pisses me off is that she had this thought before she ever got these gliders. Think about sending them to you w/o telling the breeder, before she ever got them is wrong. You do not buy a glider and then send it to someone else. It wasn't because there was one ill/old/overweight, she had the thoughts, per her own words, before the gliders arrived.

And Lauren's words to Laurie.

If you think what I was thinking of doing was SO wrong why didn't you say that to me at the time. All I remember you saying was don't let anyone find out what your doing.

You say this wasn't a plan, Laurie says Lauren told her it was, and here Lauren admits she was planning on it and told Laurie, and she wonders why Laurie didn't say something if it was so wrong. Why whould Lauren herself say it was her plan, and you say it never was?

It may not have been your plan, but per her words, it was at least a thought in her plan.

This has nothing to do with gliders in CA, or you breeding. It has to do with buying gliders without the thoughts of keeping them forever. I am looking at this as a breeder.

Linda, if you gave or sold one of your joeys to Lauren, then later found out that she had wanted to/or did give that joey to ABRA, wouldn't you be Piddled? You prob. wouldn't sell to Abra, just because of her past. Others don't want to sell to you, not because your anything like Abra (far from it) but because you live in CA. If somene had a plan to deceive you before they ever got your joey, and you got word about it, you would be mad. Wouldn't you?
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Re: Just curious....

Post by queenduck on Mon May 12, 2008 7:53 pm

How od is this glider that came from PP? I have been to her house several times, and have 1 male from PP, overweight is not an issue I have ever seen there.
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Re: Just curious....

Post by Suggiemom on Mon May 12, 2008 8:15 pm

Please don't think I was saying PP had an issue with over weight gliders. I don't know anything about her gliders, just that lately I've seen a few posts just off handedly mentioning it and I have these five boys here that were H U G E!

Here is my issue with this whole Lauren/Linda thing....when it was told to me it was told to me as if it were a plan the two of you were totally in on together. It was never mentioned that Lauren wanted to send expensive gliders out of the kindness of her wittle heart. It was said as in "I am purchasing them to send to Linda to get wf/wt joeys".

I don't pay attention to all the breeder hooplamumbojumbo, BUT nowhere in there did Lauren mention this was just her idea. Just the opposite in fact. Not ONCE did she say, Linda doesn't even know about it, it's a surprise. Not once.

In hindsight I should have mentioned it publicly or emailed you to ask if you knew about it, but I honestly just didn't think past the idea that people would be Piddled because they'd been lied to. Since I had already decided after several situations with Lauren that she was lying on a regular basis, I just kind of filed it all away. I didn't think about the repercussions of someone sending their baby to live with someone only to later find out that they'd been lied to.

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Re: Just curious....

Post by kitkatt1216 on Mon May 12, 2008 8:44 pm

Boy I go to take a final for school for an hour and come back to this lol.

Linda PMed me to ask what I was talking about, but to avoid he said she said bullroses I'd rather discuss it openly. I'm curious if she remembers what I'm talking about. So for now all I want to say is when people do something to help you out, and you don't follow through on something you said you would do with it, that brings into question alot of things. Especially when the help is rather large scale, as is what I am talking about. Anyone remember what I'm talking about??
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Re: Just curious....

Post by Suggiemom on Mon May 12, 2008 9:22 pm

Does it have anything to do with that raffle for the rescues from awhile back? I heard mumblings back then, but again, didn't pay it much attention because then the issue with the airline happened and that's all I paid attention to.

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Re: Just curious....

Post by kitkatt1216 on Mon May 12, 2008 10:27 pm

:cheers: why yes Laurie, I think that might be it.


Last edited by kitkatt1216 on Mon May 12, 2008 11:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Just curious....

Post by Srlb on Mon May 12, 2008 11:13 pm

I'm sorry, maybe I am going on a serious lack of sleep here....but please do tell.....


WHAT does Robyn (the overweight glider) have to do with the FACT that Lauren was going to buy gliders from Priscilla or ANY OTHER breeder and turn around and send them to an ILLEGAL state herself since the ORIGNIAL BREEDER chose they did NOT want their gliders going to an illegal state???

Linda, NOBODY is saying you do not do a really good thing by rescuing gliders in an illegal state. And everyone knows that I personally feel like if you (or anyone else in an illegal state) are trying to help the gliders, than you would not be breeding and selling them. You would find them in CALIFORNIA, and get them in good health and as quick as you could, find them a forever home in a legal state.

We all know how well you take care of the animals in your care. Not one of us doubt that. But it was Laurens intentions from before she purchased these gliders, to send them to you. I have a hard time thinking you didnt know she was going to.
It would kind of be like me buying a glider from Sheila for Alicia, after Sheila already turned Alicia down. Do you think I would just buy it and take the chance that Alicia would have room for it or even want it? No.

Going on no sleep here. I was just wondering why once again it seems like someone is trying to change the topic to go to someone else and bash someone else instead of keeping the spotlight on the one this thread was opened about.
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Re: Just curious....

Post by kitkatt1216 on Tue May 13, 2008 12:13 am

Sorry it's taken me so long to get back to this. I've been looking through GC and AC to try to find the original posts to go along with the story. At first I was reluctant to share this, but someone has encouraged me to do so, and so here it is. While no directly related to what is going on now, it does provide some details on how one of the people involved has been questionable before today.

Laurie was right when she guessed it was related to the raffle. I don't know how many people remember the big raffle that Allison and I threw together for the big group of rescues Linda took in, to cover neuter costs. Alot of you donated or bought tickets, we ended up with two separate raffles because we were just flooded with donations (you guys are all great, I would do it again in a heartbeat for that reason).

The original plan was to have all the donations sent to me, except the gift certificates which if I remember correctly were from Lynsie and Karin, who being larger well known vendors I felt I could trust fat their word. Allison was taking care of the ticket sales and money, and I was taking care of donations.

First, we DID do this raffle 100% of our own will. Linda never asked for the help, and didn't even involve herself in it till it started to pick up. Therefore really, we were the ones responsible for the outcome and I take full responsibility for a mistake in judgement. But given the situation, I think it's fair to say most of you would have made the same choice.

All the donations came in except for two things. One of these were toys and bowls Linda herself was donating, and the other was a cage set that a good friend of hers was making to donate. Honestly, I know it was someone on the board that lived near her but I can't recall the name. Linda promised me they were both good for the donations that were ready to go and wanted me to start up the raffle because the bill was coming due. So I did. Originally, she too was going to ship to me, but we ended up deciding it would be more practical and timely for her to ship straight to the winner. Seeming as she was the one benefiting from it all, I assumed she, too, would be good for her word.

But the winner never got these prizes. Linda was in daily contact with me from the day she involved herself till the drawing was complete and the money collected. The all of a sudden it would take me weeks to get an answer. I kept getting emails from the winner saying she hadn't recieved the stuff yet, and kept forwarding the message to Linda who took a week to get back to me only to continuously say they would be in the mail the next day. We gave up asking after 3+ months of promises it was on the way

I know if someone raised this much money to help me I would be following through with my promise immediately. Instead, I was made to look bad when numerous people told me I was irresponsible for doing a raffle without having collected everything. But I never told anyone, until now, who it was that didn't send their stuff. Except the person who was suppose to recieve it, because I offered to pay to replace it and she refused, understanding how I would make the choice I did. I understand with that many gliders there was alot going on, but it was a convenient time for communication to stop when the money was sent.

Wow, that was alot longer than I intended. Like I said, not specifically related to this topic but perhaps gives a different perspective of the character of those involved. Maybe she honestly forgot about it, but I know I couldn't forget about someone who helped my raise money to cover that many neuters (we paid for every single one, with a few hundred dollars extra that I told her to use to either help care for them or pay for shipping them to new homes)
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Re: Just curious....

Post by SugarBaby on Tue May 13, 2008 3:10 am

Wow.. so my character is defined by three or four $2 bowls and a coconut house that I made myself? A one time thing that I didn't do. To be honest with you, I DID forget about them. I had no idea what you were talking about and felt like an donkeybutt after you said the bowls were never sent. I don't even know where they are at.. and as for my "friend", I cannot account for her donation of the cage set... she has 200 pouches cut out for me (I am a fabric and pouch addict).. they have been cut out for almost 3 years and only about 20 of them have ever been sewn... I cannot control other peoples actions and I am sorry for my own... I seriously didn't realize that I never sent the bowls. I had 38 gliders that I had to bring home all in ONE day, only to have a trio follow right after, and then a very ill colony of 9. I WAS overwhelmed for months. Something like that I will never do again, I was in school full time, working, and killing myself trying to care for all of those gliders because somebody else was an idiot and didn't lift a finger to care for THEIR animals that THEY started breeding. You have no idea how many times I fell asleep while feeding them or simply collapsed on the floor because I was mentally and physically exhausted caring for that many.

To be honest with you, I am not good at sending ANYTHING out in the mail and I do not have a good memory when I am scatter brained. I am also not always able to reply to e-mails or messages when I get them. It is very possible that the contact was "suddenly cut off" when I got BANNED from GC, TWICE in a row.. for 30 days and then 45 days. I NORMALLY am pretty darn good at doing things for other people when I say that I will. It's not an excuse, but it was not an intentional thing. I cost myself huge late fees all the time because I never get my bills out on time! 🇳🇴

I have always been thankful for the raffle that was thrown.. and I let you know that numerous times. Having 20+ males neutered was amazing and I will be forever thankful for the $800+ that was sent toward it.. when only $800 more was needed. Those boys would have had to wait much longer to be fixed if it weren't for you.

Wow, that was alot longer than I intended. Like I said, not specifically related to this topic but perhaps gives a different perspective of the character of those involved. Maybe she honestly forgot about it, but I know I couldn't forget about someone who helped my raise money to cover that many neuters (we paid for every single one, with a few hundred dollars extra that I told her to use to either help care for them or pay for shipping them to new homes)

May 22, 2007 Payment From Allison Dapo Completed Details $867.27 USD (fee) -$25.45 USD $841.82 USD

I am not downplaying the raffle at all, it was a huge success and I am very, very grateful.. but now you are bending the truth... you did not send "a couple hundred extra"... and the raffle did not pay for every single neuter.. $1,000 total was needed to neuter the males and $200 needed as a down payment for them all to be neutered.. if I were to have taken the rescue money to do other things with, or if I were a vendor or even just a person that continually promised to send things and didn't, I could see you sitting here and judging my character.. but not for a one time thing that I didn't even know you were upset with me for! I am sorry that they were not sent and I am willing to make that up to the winner, but I don't even remember who it was... so if you would reply to my PM I can make it right.
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Re: Just curious....

Post by kitkatt1216 on Tue May 13, 2008 10:44 am

Linda sending you a PM. Maybe we can straighten our issue out, maybe not.

But that just doesn't look right to me and I am wondering what happened, because while I don't know an exact amount I KNOW we raised more than that.
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Re: Just curious....

Post by SugarBaby on Tue May 13, 2008 10:48 am

Replied to your PM.

That is the only money I was given.. it was all sent to my Paypal account in one shot.. and nothing from the raffle was sent to my vet. An individual called my vet and paid the down payment of $200 for all the neuters to be completed.
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Re: Just curious....

Post by kitkatt1216 on Tue May 13, 2008 10:50 am

Well I suppose my memory must be very bad then huh... unless it all got eaten in paypal fees being sent to Allison. Either way, the amount of money wasn't the point here.
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Re: Just curious....

Post by jacknsally on Tue May 13, 2008 11:00 am

A little off topic BUT - But I have to ask

Lauren- the other glider you got from Pricilla - the one with issues. Did you buy her or was she one of those get a glider free with purchase? Also, were you aware of her conditions before she came to you?

I'm concerned and have my speculations about Pricilla but I will wait for your answers before I say more.
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Re: Just curious....

Post by valkyriemome on Tue May 13, 2008 11:27 am

I hate these threads.

They always remind me of sharks during a feeding frenzy with blood in the water.

What exactly is expected at this point of Lauren or Linda? I'm not in any way suggesting that I condone Lauren's actions. But, say she is humbled and wanting to say she was wrong and move on ... How would that be possible when the water is already frothy? Does anyone really believe that, for example, Tanya could appear on here and say, "I made some horrible mistakes. Please forgive me." and she would be forgiven? The past would be left in the past? Or rather, everytime she stubbed her toe, someone would be there to point a finger and call in the sharks. I seriously doubt there is anything Lauren could do at this point to appease the most zealous of you. So, why would she try? Wouldn't an actual friend -if she has any left - advise her to stay the heck away, and post NOTHING, lest she give more ammunition and become an object of further mockery?

Another thing - and I'm not trying to distract - but ... with the fickle winds of Glider Friendship, why would anyone confide anything in anyone??!! Good friends one day, and then Person A becomes aggrivated with Person B, and all the secrets shared during a close friendship are now fair game for the spilling. I'm annoyed with someone I was previously close with, and now, in an attempt to hurt that person, I can tell the circling sharks everything that was revealed in confidence?

When I first made the step from "glider owner" to "member of the glider community", I was given advice from an "old-timer". I was told - Trust No One. Your best friend will someday stab you in the back. I thought that advice was paranoid at the time. Now, I'm so very grateful!

My closest friend - not in the "community" - knows my whole life. She's seen me stumble and fall, and been there to catch me. Likewise, I've tried to have her back. We've had disaggreements. We've even had falling outs. But I can't imagine going to our other mutual friends and telling them any one thing that I was told in confidence, "Back when we were friends." What a betrayal! Why would anyone in this community ever trust anyone else? Your friend today will be the one with the knife in your back tomorrow. "Et tu, Brutus?"
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Re: Just curious....

Post by Suggiemom on Tue May 13, 2008 11:53 am

Alden, I really don't give a crap if you think I betrayed Lauren by telling. SHE is the one who did wrong here, not me and when people like you stop patting her on her wittle head and saying "Ohh poor little Lauren" maybe she'll grow the hell up and stop trying to SCREW PEOPLE OVER! It's bleeding hearts that keep people like her doing the pooh they do. You won't think "Oh poor Lauren" when someday you're on the receiving end of the screwing over part I can assure you.

I'm always willing to give people a second chance, but once you lose my trust you dont get it back by just saying "Oh, I'm sorry." Those are just words. You have to prove it to me by actions. Has Lauren? Not just no, but HELL NO. When she SCREWED Cindy over she said she was sorry, and guess what? She CONTINUED to screw her over. Her own actions are what got her here and her own actions are what will get her out of the situation. Sticking her head up her arse and crying about how dark it is isn't going to help her case.

As for Linda....I don't believe for one second she's totally innocent in all of this. NO ONE buys expensive gliders to just give away as a present to someone; especially when it's a glider they themselves covet. You'll never convince me otherwise. Lauren said they were in on it together. She told me Linda would be mad if she knew that I knew. Lauren is a LIAR. I don't think it's a permanent condition. She's young and healthy. I think she can over come the affliction if she chooses to do so.

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Re: Just curious....

Post by valkyriemome on Tue May 13, 2008 12:20 pm

Suggiemom wrote: The point in responding is to help people understand that you know what you did was WRONG. You have never once apologized for any of the things you've done. Grow the hell up Lauren and take responsibility for your mistakes.

In this post, you imply that if she responded - therefore helping people understand that she knows the error of her ways - and apologized, and then meets the standards of maturity you require, she can be forgiven.

I think you are kitchen-sinking. Maybe not. Was the situation with Cindy (which I know nothing about) ever rectified? If so, why do you bring it up? Because she can never really have forgiveness and move on. Every mistake must be judged by every other mistake, compounded. Until the mass of mistakes is too large to overcome.

I specifically did not mention you in reference to "betrayal". Instead, I pointed out that I see it as a larger symptom than just you and Lauren. However, since you brought it up ... If you thought what Lauren was doing was wrong, why didn't you start this thread back in December? Because what is "wrong" for a friend of yours isn't the same thing as what is "wrong" for someone who has somehow crossed you? I'm sincerely wondering why. I'm not trying to start crap.

I know you don't give a crap what I think. Never expected you to feel otherwise. But - when exactly did I pat Lauren's wittle head?

I'm using this tormented thread as an opportunity to point out what I perceive are larger problems. I wasn't singling you out. I'd seriously like to know ... for someone who has been the subject of one of these threads, is redemption even a realistic goal? What would it take? Hypothetically - not specific to any individual. If someone falls off the approved path - is there any way back at all?


Last edited by valkyriemome on Tue May 13, 2008 12:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Just curious....

Post by jacknsally on Tue May 13, 2008 12:20 pm

Alden- it takes more to being a friend then just sharing conversations, pm's and opinions on a glider forum. Maybe it's just me that feels that way. I do live by the Trust No One theory for internet interaction. People are so capable of being who they are not on a forum/website and you just can't really tell. Me personally it takes more than just spending time on a forum with someone to build a friendship- until you have person to person interaction, you just don't know what your really building.
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Re: Just curious....

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