Laurie's Glider Gazette
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Teresa/Dancing

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Teresa/Dancing

Post by Srlb on Fri Mar 04, 2011 4:42 pm

So, she can run her mouth all over the place about how everyone else is doing things and she is never at fault for her own stuff. I did notice after she was asked about Mary and Charlies Money she got quiet. I know nothing about that, so I wont say what I *feel* about that whole situation, but you know, she totally hit a nerve with me with her holier than thou post making it sound like she would NEVER have ANYTHING to do with a mill breeder/broker. And if that were completely true, I could even respect her for that. However....right after the SGGA Miss Teresa contacted Virgil Klunder herself. He did not go to her, she went to him. She offered to make him pouches at a *reasonable cost*. I have nothing against her trying to reach out to offer help at all, but do NOT sit there later after he turned you down and act like you would NEVER even consider the possibility of working with someone. The TRUTH always comes out, so I suggest you always do things that you would never be ashamed of or things you would NOT regret doing.

I contacted Virgil today and I asked him for his permission to post this. He told me I could. He was disappointed that Teresa never took him up on his offer and allow him to call her to try to find a happy medium place.

Virgils answers are in Caps. And yes, he is a talker!!


From: T. Haas <dancinggc@yahoo.com>
To: virgil@sugarbears.com
Sent: Tue, August 17, 2010 10:06:09 PM
Subject: Sugar Gliders, I was at the SGGA

Hello,
I sent you an email last week and have not had any reply. I wanted to check to see if you received it or if it is lost in cyber space.



On Tue, 8/17/10, Virgil Klunder <virgil@sugarbears.com> wrote:


From: Virgil Klunder <virgil@sugarbears.com>
Subject: Re: Sugar Gliders, I was at the SGGA
To: "T. Haas" <dancinggc@yahoo.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 2010, 9:45 PM


didn't get anything. please resend. Virgil


This e-mail message and any attached files are strictly confidential and are intended solely for the addressee(s) named above. This communication is highly confidential and may contain material protected by attorney-client, copyrights, trademarks, work product, or other privileges. Regardless of whether you are the intended recipient or not - any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing, copying, or other distribution of this e-mail message and any attached files without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY prohibited.

All the information provided to our customers and published on the Pocket Pets website has been reviewed and approved by multiple licensed animal care professionals and at least one Licensed Doctor of Veterinary Medicine - all of whom specialize in Sugar Gliders. The company, and its directors, employees or agents are not licensed veterinarians and nothing associated with this communication is to be construed as - or relied upon - as veterinary advice. As such, you are strongly encouraged to consult with a licensed Veterinarian who specializes in Sugar Gliders regarding any specific health issues, questions or concerns. If you have received this confidential communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail message and permanently delete the original message.



From: T. Haas <dancinggc@yahoo.com>
To: Virgil Klunder <virgil@sugarbears.com>
Sent: Wed, August 18, 2010 12:51:51 AM
Subject: Re: Sugar Gliders, I was at the SGGA

Thank you for the quick reply. Email is convient but often gets eaten in cyber space it seems. This is a copy of the original.

Dear Mr. Klunder,


My name is Teresa. I want to be clear about my feelings before I continue. I am not a fan of your business. I have been very much against your practices from the start. I’ve had gliders for over 11 years now with my oldest glider being over 13 years old. I am a small hobby breeder as well as a rescue home. I have taken in hundreds of gliders over the years so I have very strong opinions of those that sell gliders in venues such as home shows, flea markets, trade shows or malls. I do understand it is a business to you and we have very different opinions but I believe we can work together if it is for the betterment of the gliders. THANKS. I COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND YOUR POSITION - AND DON'T DISAGREE WITH IT. I PERSONALLY GOT A LOT MORE OUT OF THE CONFERENCE THAN I THOUGHT I WOULD - INCLUDING ABOUT 6-10 IDEAS THAT I WANT TO START IMPLEMENTING AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE. I'VE BEEN CORRESPONDING BACK/FORTH WITH QUITE A FEW PEOPLE THERE - AND I THINK THERE ARE SOME THINGS WE ARE BOTH LEARNING ABOUT EACH OTHER THAT WILL ULTIMATELY HELP THESE ANIMALS. OF COURSE, THERE IS ALSO A FAIR AMOUNT OF RABID 'BASHING' - BUT THAT'S NO DIFFERENT THAN BEFORE. THOSE WHO WANT TO SINK DOWN TO THAT LEVEL WILL ALWAYS DO SO NO MATTER WHAT I SAY/DO. AS I SAID AT THE CONFERENCE SEVERAL TIMES, I DIDN'T COME THERE TO TRY TO MAKE ANYONE LIKE ME - OR EVEN AGREE WITH ME. I JUST WANTED TO TELL THE TRUTH AND PROVE THAT VERY FEW THINGS SAID ABOUT US IN THE CHATROOMS IS TRUE. WHAT ENDED UP HAPPENING - INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH - IS THAT THERE TURNED OUT TO BE A HANDFUL OF PEOPLE LIKE YOU WHO ARE GENUINELY INTERESTED IN LEARNING AND GROWING OUR KNOWLEDGE BASE WITH THE SOLE GOAL OF HELPING THE ANIMAL - AND THAT IS EXCITING STUFF - BECAUSE THERE ARE THINGS WE CAN ALL LEARN FROM EACH OTHER... :-)

I was at this year’s SGGA and I heard you say “Show me a better way”. So I would like to make a business proposal to you that will benefit the gliders you sell as well as your business and public relations.

I make and sell various glider products, toys, cage pouches, bonding pouches. I do this for many reasons but mainly to help enrich the lives of gliders.

As you know (and heard at the SGGA) gliders should be provided with nice comfortable SAFE pouches to sleep in. The quality of the fleece as well as how they are sewn is very important to the safety of these pouches.

By making sure that each Joey you sell goes home with a nice safe pouch to sleep in, it will show the glider community that you are listening to our concerns and are working to make things better for the gliders. The online glider community is very tight knit and it would be a benefit to you if you were able to tell them that you are supplying the gliders with well made safe pouches made by one of the online community vendors.

I would like to discuss supplying to you safe well sewn cage pouches in bulk that you can then pass on with the gliders you sell. I can offer them to you for a price that allows you to do a mark up on them while still making them affordable to those that buy them. I make cage pouches in two different styles and am willing to send you one of each for your inspection. One is a simple pouch with straight sewn corners; the other has “boxed” corners. They are double layered anti-pill fleece with “hidden” seams. Both are equally safe. It is just a personal preference as to which style of pouch is used. I also believe that I can meet the demand for the number of pouches you would need.

If you are interested in discussing this further, I am definitely willing. I may be reached by email at dancinggc@yahoo.com or by phone at 620 215 4857 (any time after 11 am central time please as I am up most all night with my gliders).

I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR PROACTIVE APPROACH TO ALL THIS - SO WITH THAT IN MIND I'LL TRY TO GIVE YOU A LITTLE MORE INSIGHT ON WHERE WE ARE COMING FROM ON THIS ISSUE. AGAIN, I'M NOT TRYING TO CONVINCE YOU OF ANYTHING - JUST PUTTING THE INFORMATION OUT THERE.

ON THE ISSUE OF CAGE POUCHES, I'M NOT SURE IF WE COVERED THAT IN THE MAIN SESSION - OR IN THE SECOND SESSION - BUT WE DID GET INTO IT QUITE A BIT. IT TIES INTO SEVERAL OTHER ISSUES (LIKE HEAT ROCKS, ETC) SO I'LL TRY TO KEEP IT SHORT HERE SO I DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME - AND THEN I CAN CALL YOU AND DISCUSS IN MORE DEPTH IF YOU LIKE. :-)


YEARS AGO, WE PURPOSELY MADE THE DECISION NOT TO USE CAGE POUCHES (ALTHOUGH WE ARE NOW RECONSIDERING IT ON SOME LEVEL - SEE BELOW) SHORTLY AFTER WE FIRST BEGAN FOR SEVERAL CONCRETE REASONS. FIRST, I UNDERSTAND COMPLETELY THAT THE ANIMAL LOOOOVES THEM - AND IS INSTINCTUALLY DRAWN TO THEM. I USED THEM MYSELF FOR MANY YEARS - AND HAD NO PROBLEM WITH THEM - UNTIL I FOUND SOMETHING THAT WORKS BETTER.


IF YOU REMEMBER BACK TO THE FIRST SESSION, I SAID THAT MY FIRST CONCERN IS ALWAYS FOR THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF THE ANIMAL. MY SECOND CONCERN IS THAT THE CUSTOMER HAS THE BEST POSSIBLE EXPERIENCE WITH THE ANIMAL AS A COMPANION PET. THIS IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT TO US BECAUSE IF THE CUSTOMER CAN TRANSFORM THEIR BABY IN THE FIRST 30 DAYS THEY HAVE THEM FROM A SCARED LITTLE TIKE WHO WANTS NOTHING TO DO WITH THEM - INTO A LOVING COMPANION THAT LITERALLY HANGS OUT WITH THEM ALL THE TIME - THAT ANIMAL IS GOING TO HAVE A FULFILLED, AMAZING LIFE OF LOVE AND HAPPINESS...


THAT BEING SAID, THE PROBLEM WITH CAGE POUCHES - THAT I HAVE TO ADDRESS - IS MY CUSTOMERS ARE ALL NEWBIES. FOR PEOPLE LIKE YOURSELF - OR ME - WE HAVE NO PROBLEM REACHING INTO A CAGE AND GETTING A BABY OUT OF A POUCH - REGARDLESS OF CRABBING, RUNNING AWAY, NIPPING, ETC... TO US IT'S JUST PART OF THE PROCESS - AND WE KNOW THAT WHAT WE ARE DOING IS BEST FOR THE ANIMAL IN THE LONG RUN - EVEN IF THEY DON'T APPRECIATE IT RIGHT AT THAT MOMENT.


AGAIN, THERE IS NOOOOOOOOTHING WRONG WITH CAGE POUCHES IN 'THEORY' - BUT IN THE WORLD WHERE I MUST LIVE - THE SAD, UNAVOIDABLE FACT IS THAT USING A CAGE POUCH ALMOST ALWAYS DOOMS THE ANIMAL TO A LIFE OF LONLINESS WHERE IT WILL NEVER BOND WITH - OR BE PLAYED WITH - BY THE OWNERS.


NOW, I KNOW HOW STRANGE - AND UNTRUE - THIS SOUNDS TO PEOPLE LIKE YOURSELF - AND ME - WHO HAVE A LOT OF EXPERIENCE WITH THESE ANIMALS - BUT IT'S AN UNAVOIDABLE FACT THAT WE HAVE TESTED TIME AND TIME AGAIN. WHEN WE FIRST STARTED, WE TESTED BOTH CAGE POUCHES - AND A HEAT ROCK/NESTING CLOTH COMBO - WITH HUNDREDS OF CLIENTS, AND CALCULATED THE RESULTS. IN OVER 90% OF THE CASES WHERE WE HAD THE CUSTOMER USE A CAGE POUCH - AT THE END OF THE FIRST 30 DAYS THEY STATED: 1) THEY WERE EITHER "SCARED" OR "VERY SCARED" OF THEIR BABY BECAUSE IT CRABBED AND STRUCK AT THEM ALMOST EVERY TIME THEY TRIED TO GET IT OUT OF THE POUCH, AND 2) THEY DID NOT FEEL THEY COULD EVER HAVE A CLOSE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE ANIMAL. NOW TO BE CLEAR, THIS IS EVEN AFTER WE PROVIDED SEVERAL VERSIONS OF DETAILED, PHOTOGRAPHIC, STEP BY STEP INSTRUCTIONS ON HOW TO GET THE BABIES OUT OF THE POUCH - BUT IN ALMOST ALL CASES THE CUSTOMER HAD THE SAME RESULT...


AGAIN, WE CONDUCTED THIS TEST EARLY ON WHEN WE FIRST BEGAN - AND ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE COIN WAS AN EQUAL NUMBER OF NEW OWNERS WHO USED THE HEAT ROCK/NESTING CLOTH COMBINATION. IN THOSE CASES, THE RESULTS WERE ALMOST A MIRROR OPPOSITE - IN THAT BY THE END OF THE FIRST 30 DAYS, ALMOST ALL OF THEM HAD DEVELOPED A "CLOSE" OR "VERY CLOSE" RELATIONSHIP WITH THEIR BABIES - THE BABIES ALMOST NEVER CRABBED OR STRUCK WHEN BEING AWOKEN - AND THEY WERE VERY FAR ALONG IN THE BONDING PROCESS.


PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT - FROM A MONEY PERSPECTIVE - WE WOULD ACTUALLY BE MUCH BETTER OFF IF WE DID SELL A CAGE POUCH - BECAUSE 1) WE COULD MAKE A DECENT MARKUP ON THAT, 2) WE MAKE ALMOST NOTHING ON THE HEAT ROCK, AND 3) THE CUSTOMER USES THEIR OWN MATERIAL FOR THE NESTING CLOTH, AGAIN MAKING US NOTHING. SO, PURELY FROM A BUSINESS STANDPOINT, IF WE GENUINELY THOUGHT FOR A SECOND THAT USING A CAGE POUCH WAS BENEFICIAL - WE WOULD DO IT IN A HEARTBEAT.

THAT BEING SAID, I AM WELLLLLLLLLLLLL AWARE OF ALL THE PROBLEMS PEOPLE OUT THERE HAVE WITH HEAT ROCKS - BUT AS I SAID IN THE CONFERENCE - PLEASE SHOWWWWWW ME WHERE THERE ARE ALL THESE 'HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF CASES' WHERE THESE ANIMALS ARE BEING BURNED OR ELECTROCUTED. BELIEVE ME, I HAVE LOOKED INTO EVERY SINGLE POST WHERE PEOPLE MAKE THESE WILD CLAIMS - AND THEY ARE ALL COMPLETE BS. AGAIN, I UNDERSTAND THAT THE IDEA OF A HEAT ROCK JUST RUBS SOME PEOPLE THE WRONG WAY - BUT I CAN PROMISE YOU THAT IN ACTUAL PRACTICE - WHEN INSTALLED CORRECTLY INTO THE CAGE - THEY DO NOTTTTTTTTTHING BUT DRAMATICALLY SPEED UP THE BONDING PROCESS - AND HELP THE ANIMAL IN OTHER WAYS AS WELL.

I HAVE GONE INTO THIS INDEPTH WITH MANY, MANY VETERINARIANS - SOME OF WHICH LIKE HEAT ROCKS IN GENERAL - SOME WHICH DON'T. HOWEVER, WHEN THEY LOOK AT THIS SPECIFIC APPLICATION - WITH THIS SPECIFIC ANIMAL - AND SEE THE BENEFITS OF USING A HEAT ROCK/NESTING CLOTH WITH THEIR OWN EYES - THE DEBATE IS OVER. THE TRUTH IS, WE HAVE LITERALLY TENS OF THOUSANDS OF CUSTOMERS WHO USE THIS COMBINATION EVERY DAY - AND HAVE BEEN FOR SEVERAL YEARS - WITHOUT ONE SINGLE INCIDENT.... NOT ONE.... THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT REGARDLESS OF HOW YOU, OR I , OR ANYONE, MAY 'FEEL' ABOUT THEM - I CAN'T DEAL IN ANYONE'S "FEELINGS" (INCLUDING MY OWN). THE FACT IS THAT THE HEAT ROCK/NESTING CLOTH COMBO JUST PLAIN WORKS - AND WORKS VERRRRRRRRRRRRRY WELL.

THAT BEING SAID, THIS PARTICULAR ISSUE IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE OF HOW OPENING DIALOGUE CAN CREATE INROADS AND OPEN DOORS THAT CAN ULTIMATELY HELP THE ANIMAL... SINCE THE CONFERENCE, I'VE HAD THIS EXACT SAME DISCUSSION WITH SEVERAL PEOPLE LIKE YOURSELF - AND A COUPLE VERY INTERESTING - AND QUITE FRANKLY EXCITING - IDEAS CAME OUT OF THE DEBATE.

FIRST, RIGHT NOW WE TELL PEOPLE TO TAKE ITEMS OF THEIR OWN CLOTHING (LIKE AN OLD T-SHIRT, ETC.)...RUB IT ON THEIR BODY AND ON THE BODY OF EVERYONE (INCLUDING PETS) IN THEIR FAMILY - AND THEN PUT THAT IN THE CAGE AS A NESTING CLOTH.... WE WARN THEM ABOUT ONLY USING NON-RAVELING MATERIALS, ETC.. THE TRUTH IS, IT WORKS FINE, AND THIS WAY THE BABIES ARE SURROUNDED BY THE SMELLS OF THEIR NEW FAMILY WHILE THEY ARE SLEEPING - SPEEDING UP THE BONDING PROCESS....

HOWEVER, DURING ONE OF OUR 'LIVELY DEBATES', THE IDEA WAS POSED ABOUT POSSIBLY INCLUDING A LARGE PIECE OF SAFE FLEECE AS A NESTING CLOTH INSTEAD - AND JUST HAVING THE OWNERS RUB IT ON THEMSELVES BEFORE PUTTING IT IN THE CAGE. THIS WAY, WE COULD BE SURE THAT THE MATERIAL BEING USED IN THE CAGES IS SAFE... NOW, EVEN THOUGH WE'VE NEVER HAD AN INCIDENT WHERE A CUSTOMER'S BABY BECAME ENTANGLED IN THEIR HOMEMADE NESTING CLOTH - THERE IS NO REASON WHY WE COULDN'T DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT WHICH WOULD ALLOW US TO BE ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN THAT THE BABIES ARE NESTING COMFORTABLY IN A SAFE ENVIRONMENT. BOTTOM LINE, IT'S A GREAT IDEA!

THEN, IN FURTHER DISCUSSIONS, IT WAS POINTED OUT TO ME THAT SINCE MY MAIN BEEF WITH CAGE POUCHES IS THAT THEY ARE COUNTERPRODUCTIVE TO THE BONDING PROCESS - WHY NOT RECOMMEND THEM TO CUSTOMERS AFTER THE BONDING PROCESS IS COMPLETE... AGAIN, I HATE TO ADMIT IT, BUT I HAD SUCH 'BLINDERS' ON AGAINST THE USE OF CAGE POUCHES - THAT IT NEVER OCCURRED TO ME THAT THEY COULD BE USED SUCCESSFULLY ONCE THE ANIMAL HAD COMPLETELY BONDED TO THEIR OWNERS. THIS WAY THEY COULD HAVE A NICE, SNUGGLY POUCH - AND THE OWNER WON'T BE SCARED OFF WHEN THEY TAKE THEM OUT.... AGAIN, I KNOW THIS SOUNDS SILLY, BUT IT IS AN EXCELLENT IDEA. I JUST NEVER CONSIDERED USING THEM LATER ON BECAUSE I KNOW FOR A FACT THAT THEY DON'T WORK WELL - FOR OUR CUSTOMERS - IN THE BEGINNING STAGES.

THAT BEING SAID, WHAT CAME OUT OF MANY 'LIVELY' DISCUSSIONS IS THAT WE ARE NOW TESTING THE USE OF A FLEECE NESTING CLOTH - AND CUSTOMER EXPERIENCES USING CAGE POUCHES THAT WE HAVE RECENTLY SENT OUT TO THEM FOR FREE - TO GATHER SOME REAL DATA ON THEM. IF I'VE LEARNED ANYTHING OVER TIME, IT'S THAT I DON'T KNOW EVERYTHING, SO BEFORE I ROLL SOMETHING OUT TO OUR CUSTOMERS, I WILL TEST, TEST, TEST IT FIRST. SO FAR, EVERYTHING IS LOOKING GOOD WITH THE INITIAL TEST GROUP - AND IF IT CONTINUES OVER THE NEXT 60 DAYS, WE WILL LIKELY BEGIN INCLUDING FLEECE NESTING CLOTHS WITH THE INITIAL PURCHASE - AND RECOMMENDING CAGE POUCHES IN HOUSEHOLDS WHERE THE ANIMALS HAVE ALREADY BONDED TO THEIR OWNERS. :-)

NOW, IS THAT GOOD ENOUGH FOR SOME PEOPLE - NO, I'M SURE IT'S NOT. SOME PEOPLE WILL JUST NEVER AGREE WITH ANYTHING WE DO - AND THAT'S FINE.

HOWEVER, AT LEAST IN MY EYES THIS IS VERY EXCITING, BECAUSE IT IS JUST ONE EXAMPLE OF HOW TWO SIDES -WITH OPPOSING IDEAS - CAN INTELLIGENTLY DEBATE AN ISSUE, WITH THE END RESULT BEING SOMETHING THAT IS BETTER FOR THE ANIMAL. AGAIN, THIS IS JUST ONE SMALL EXAMPLE, BUT FROM MY PERSPECTIVE THERE ARE AT LEAST 6-10 OTHER THINGS WE'RE LOOKING AT - JUST TO START - AND I'M HOPEFUL THAT MANY OF THESE WILL PAN OUT THE SAME WAY.

AGAIN, JUST TO BE CLEAR - (AND PLEASE DON'T TAKE THIS THE WRONG WAY) - I COULDN'T POSSIBLY CARE LESS WHAT THE 'COMMUNITY' THINKS OF ME OR OUR PRACTICES.. I AM VERRRRY COMFORTABLE DEFENDING EVERY SINGLE THING WE DO - AND DON'T WANT OR NEED THEIR 'APPROVAL' FOR ANYTHING. BOTH THEY - AND WE - DO JUST FINE WITHOUT EACH OTHER. THE THING THAT DOEEEEEEEEES EXCITE ME THOUGH IS THAT THERE IS A HANDFUL OF PEOPLE OUT THERE WHO ARE WILLING TO STEP UP TO THE PLATE AND DEBATE THE ISSUES IN DEPTH. IN MY EYES THE WORST THAT CAN POSSIBLY COME OF THIS IS THAT WE BOTH UNDERSTAND EACH OTHER BETTER - AND THE BEST IS THAT TOGETHER WE COME UP WITH NEW IDEAS THAT CAN ACTUALLY BENEFIT THE ANIMAL.

THE BOTTOM LINE HERE IS THE ANIMAL IS THE ONLY THING I CARE ABOUT - BECAUSE AS LONG AS I STAY FOCUSED ON THAT - THE REST WILL AUTOMATICALLY TAKE CARE OF ITSELF. I KNOW I MUST SOUND KIND OF 'GEEKY', BUT ANY LITTLE THING I SEE THAT CAN CHANGE THIS ANIMAL'S LIFE FOR THE BETTER - ON A PRACTICAL LEVEL - IS VERY EXCITING TO ME. I'M SURE MOST PEOPLE WOULD THINK THAT THINGS LIKE A FLEECE CLOTH AND A CAGE POUCH ARE PRETTY BORING - BUT TO ME IT'S VERY IMPORTANT STUFF - ESPECIALLY BECAUSE THIS IS JUST THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG AS TO WHAT I THINK WE CAN LEARN FROM EACH OTHER.

ALL THAT BEING SAID, I DON'T WANT TO BORE YOU ANYMORE WITH MY 'RANTS' SO I'LL CHANGE GEARS FOR A SECOND. :-) FROM A PRODUCTION STANDPOINT, AS I'M SURE YOU KNOW, WE HAVE ALWAYS ONLY ADOPTED OUR BABIES WITH A FLEECE BONDING POUCH (WORN AROUND THE NECK). IN FACT, WE WON'T ADOPT THE BABY OUT WITHOUT ONE - BECAUSE IN THAT SPECIFIC USE - THEY GREATLY ENHANCE THE BONDING PROCESS. FOR MANY YEARS, WE USED SOMEONE VERY WELL-KNOWN INSIDE 'THE COMMUNITY' TO MAKE OUR POUCHES FOR US. THE PROBLEM WAS THAT AS WE GREW, THEY JUST COULD NOT KEEP UP - AND IT REALLY WOUND UP COSTING US A LOT OF CUSTOMER RELATIONSHIPS BECAUSE NO MATTER HOW HARD THEY TRIED THEY COULDN'T FILL OUR ORDERS. WE THEN TRIED ADDING OTHER SUPPLIERS FROM WITHIN THE 'COMMUNITY' - AND EVENTUALLY OUTPACED THEM ALL TOO.

JUST TO BE CLEAR, I ALWAYS PREFER TO HELP THE SMALL BUSINESS PERSON - BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE I CAME FROM - BUT THE FACT IS THAT EVERY SINGLE TIME WE HAVE USED A SMALL MANUFACTURER FOR ANY OF OUR PRODUCTS - WE JUST GET OUR HEADS HANDED TO US - EVERY SINGLE TIME. BECAUSE OF THIS, OUR BOARD NOW HAS A FIRM RULE TO ONLY USE LARGE, COMMERCIAL MANUFACTURERS FOR ALL OF OUR PRODUCTS - AND FURTHERMORE, THAT WE ALWAYS HAVE AT LEAST TWO OF THEM FOR EACH PRODUCT WE OFFER. THIS ENSURES ENOUGH QUANTITY, AND A BACKUP IN CASE ONE OF THE SUPPLIERS GOES DOWN. THAT BEING SAID, I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR OFFER. SEVERAL OTHERS INSIDE THE 'COMMUNITY' HAVE ALSO OFFERED SIMILAR THINGS - AND WHILE I TRULY WISH I COULD USE EVERY ONE - THE REALITIES OF OUR PRODUCTION WON'T ALLOW ME THAT OPTION.

AGAIN, THE WHOLE TOPIC OF CAGE POUCHES, HEAT ROCKS, ETC IS A MUCH BIGGER ISSUE THAN I CAN TYPE HERE, AND I DON'T WANT TO WASTE YOUR TIME BLATHERING ON - SO IF YOU'D LIKE TO DISCUSS IT FURTHER I'D BE HAPPY TO GIVE YOU A BUZZ. THAT WAY WE CAN COVER A LOT MORE GROUND AND WE CAN DISCUSS EVERYTHING IN MORE DEPTH. AT THE RISK OF SOUNDING EVEN GEEKIER - I LOVE TALKING ABOUT THESE GUYS AND WAYS TO HELP THEM. I JUST WISH I HAD MORE HOURS IN THE DAY. ;-)

THANKS SOOOOOOO MUCH FOR YOUR OFFER AND YOUR WILLINGNESS TO DISCUSS ISSUES. IT MEANS A LOT TO ME THAT THERE ARE AT LEAST SOME PEOPLE OUT THERE ON THE INTERNET WHO ARE GENUINELY INTERESTED IN FURTHERING THE DEBATE - AND KNOWLEDGE - OF OUR LITTLE BUDDIES - AND I FOR ONE - AM LOOKING FORWARD TO THE CHALLENGE. :-) VIRGIL



Sincerely,

Teresa Haas



Forwarded Message ----
From: Virgil Klunder <virgil@sugarbears.com>
To: T. Haas <dancinggc@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wed, August 18, 2010 11:48:37 AM
Subject: Re: Sugar Gliders, I was at the SGGA


Hi Teresa: not sure what happened to that first email, but I'll try to respond as briefly as possible in ALL CAPS below for ease of reading. :-) Virgil


This e-mail message and any attached files are strictly confidential and are intended solely for the addressee(s) named above. This communication is highly confidential and may contain material protected by attorney-client, copyrights, trademarks, work product, or other privileges. Regardless of whether you are the intended recipient or not - any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing, copying, or other distribution of this e-mail message and any attached files without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY prohibited.

All the information provided to our customers and published on the Pocket Pets website has been reviewed and approved by multiple licensed animal care professionals and at least one Licensed Doctor of Veterinary Medicine - all of whom specialize in Sugar Gliders. The company, and its directors, employees or agents are not licensed veterinarians and nothing associated with this communication is to be construed as - or relied upon - as veterinary advice. As such, you are strongly encouraged to consult with a licensed Veterinarian who specializes in Sugar Gliders regarding any specific health issues, questions or concerns. If you have received this confidential communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail message and permanently delete the original message.


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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by queenduck on Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:09 pm

Say it isn't so!

I'm sure if Teresa adresses this (which she wont) she will say she was just seeing what he would say. She'll say she would have never really worked for him, or sold to him at a price where he could still have room to mark up her pouches to make money for himself (because we all know she can not support ANYTHING that has to do with a mill breeder/broker. It's all just a big misunderstanding I am sure.

Or maybe.... she doesn't consider Virgil Kluder to be a mill breeder/broker. Himm, maybe that is it.

I support people who stand up for their beliefs, even if they differ from mine. What I don't support is a hypocrite who will slam someone for something they have done in the past or may be doing now (yet hoping their little secret stays just that).

I happen to know Peggy has had this email a LONG time. She could have posted it last year to say... see, Teresa isn't who she says she is, she doesn't really believe what she pots. But Peggy didn't do that. She didn't really care, until Teresa choose to blast her for something she herself was more than eager to do.Guess when it comes to money (or leus) what you promised and what you believe to be your morals to be, sometimes doesn't maters.

I learned long ago there are two Teresa's. The Teresa who she is in real life and then there is Teresa/Dancing, an act she plays on GC. They really are not the same person.



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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by tinkerbellesmomm on Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:30 pm

Interesting read
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by Suggiemom on Fri Mar 04, 2011 6:05 pm

Can anyone say H Y P O C R I T E? Say it with me now.....

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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by finnessa on Fri Mar 04, 2011 6:17 pm

Very interesting but not at all shocking. Makes one wonder what she would have said or not said in the thread had he of taken her up on her offer or better yet if she would have said a word. Reading this and her posts she sounds spiteful because he turned her down and not because of who he is/what he does.

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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by Suggiemom on Fri Mar 04, 2011 6:26 pm

Teresa is a snake in the grass and always has been. She has a public face that she puts forward and then there is the REAL Teresa, the one who hunkers down behind pm's and what not, egging people on to do her bidding, etc.

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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by GliderGuyVa on Fri Mar 04, 2011 6:35 pm

Busted!!!!!!!!! Is this posted over on GC? That would be cool :)
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by Suggiemom on Fri Mar 04, 2011 6:38 pm

Ohhh, they'd NEVER allow that! Much better to let people post opinion without facts and harass someone who is trying to do a good thing than to post actual PROOF that someone is a HYPOCRITE!

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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by DirtyPaws on Fri Mar 04, 2011 6:43 pm

Gah Peggy! You've been holding an awfully big pile of :poo poo: for a LONG time!

Darn near have to flush TWICE for that one! :funny stuff:
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by mizvalorie on Fri Mar 04, 2011 6:57 pm

I would say Eddie address this without saying names

Removing the quotes as it is against GC's rules apparently copy infringement? BS. Whatever. Read his second paragraph in his "non bashing" post on peggys new thread.

Maybe he hasn't seen this thread and the information about Dancing yet?
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by wclanton423 on Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:06 pm

But it definitely looks like Eddie has read this because he just locked the other thread on GC and opened up a new one and mentions this situation on the new thread.

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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by wclanton423 on Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:06 pm

Haha Val! We always post at the same time.

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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by mizvalorie on Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:21 pm

Great minds think a like!!
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by Srlb on Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:33 pm

Busted!!!!!!!!! Is this posted over on GC? That would be cool :)

I was given permission to post this where ever I wanted to just to show PROOF and FACTS.... yes, DOCUMENTED Proof at that.

So if any of you wish to post it elsewhere, go ahead.
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by wclanton423 on Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:38 pm

OMG!!! Someone do it on GC. I'm too scared, lol. You know that caca would get pulled so quick and a spanking handed to you...or a ban, lol.

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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by angelic4296 on Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:16 pm

What a freaking fake idiotic moron...my blood is BOILING...who's gonna post it over there, huh huh huh????

This, along with the fact that Mary hasn't seen that money yet as far as we know, proves what a lying, coniving, deceitful, terrible person Teresa is....I have NO respect for her, she's disgusting....


Last edited by angelic4296 on Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:17 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Added stuff)
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by vhenke on Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:27 pm

:boo hoo: think I stay off gc now
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by usha77 on Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:15 pm

:rose glass: You all know me - always looking for the good in people. I don't really have a true, honest opinion about Teresa one way or the other (because of who I am), but if these situations are true (which I have no reason to believe they are not!), my respect for her has declined - of course, there are other reasons it has declined over the years, but I can never really hate her because she united me with my Toffee and Zoey. As I have said countless times and will assuredly say again, I can like a person and not like what they do/say or how they act. No matter how bad she behaves, there will always be a part of me that loves her because of my Toffee and Zoey and how they came to me and how she acted towards me and them at that time. Yeah, I'm pathetic, I know! :funny stuff:
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by tinkerbellesmomm on Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:18 pm

Brenda I love you and who you are rose colored glasses and all!
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by obsolescenttears on Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:19 pm

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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by usha77 on Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:36 pm

Thank you, Coeli - I love you, too!

And, T...so cute - I love that one!
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by macwood6 on Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:54 pm

:=)):
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by obsolescenttears on Fri Mar 04, 2011 11:00 pm

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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by usha77 on Fri Mar 04, 2011 11:10 pm

:funny stuff:
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

Post by mizvalorie on Sat Mar 05, 2011 12:13 am

Teresa has now posted this on Facebook.
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Re: Teresa/Dancing

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